Tell me more ×
History Stack Exchange is a question and answer site for historians and history buffs. It's 100% free, no registration required.

The United States is often referred to as a "class-less" society where anyone can rise to any height. Leaving aside whether this is actually the case or not, when and how did this idea originate? Was it part of the Enlightenment ideas of the founding generation, or was it something that came along later?

share|improve this question
I don't think we really became "class-less" until the 80's – DForck42 Oct 25 '11 at 17:42
3  
Since when is the USA class-less while all the politicians always talk about the middle class or the working class? :) Joke aside. There are clearly at least racial classes in the USA. – txwikinger Oct 25 '11 at 20:21
I've heard the term floated here and there so someone is using it to describe the U.S. I agree that there are social classes in the U.S., often very distinctly divided. However, I'm interested in how the idea that the U.S. somehow doesn't have classes came about. – World Engineer Oct 25 '11 at 20:24
6  
The idea stems from the French Revolution and its mantra liberty, equality, fraternity. Equality bringing the class-less idea by eliminating the aristocracy. However, even the French revolution was not true to its idea, since in some ways the aristocracy was merely replaced by the bourgeois and hence again created different classes. – txwikinger Oct 25 '11 at 20:29
Request a re-edit to remove the term "class", which is causing debate. Can you phrase the question in a way that the answers don't have to include this contentious term? – Mark C. Wallace Dec 10 '12 at 18:11
show 3 more comments

5 Answers

up vote 11 down vote accepted

The United States was in the "new world." As such, it didn't START with many of the class structures common to European societies.

As such, it was regarded as a good "testing ground" for theories of a classless society stemming from the Enlightenment. The "founding generation," even though heavily tilted toward the upper class, was greatly influenced by these ideas, and wrote them into the Declaration of Independence, the Constitution, and other founding documents.

America has never been a fully "classless" society. What HAS been true is that many of the class barriers that stood in people's ways in Europe didn't operate particularly well in the U.S. In an achieving society, the ethos has been to promote a meritorious individual from the "wrong" background over a mediocre one from a good background.

Western European countries have largely adopted "American" ideas of a democratic meritocracy, to their benefit. Some of them now arguably have more social mobility than the U.S.

But the U.S. will probably long maintain its reputation as the site of the global "lab experiment" in equality.

share|improve this answer
Ideas in France and America about equality influenced each other in various complex ways (I don't know the details). If I had to hazard a guess, I'd say that French enlightened culture exerted greater influence on America than vice versa, considering the extensive production of enlightened literature in France prior to the Revolutions; but it is remarkable that America went first. I believe the democracies of Europe, while no doubt also influenced by the American Revolution, mostly looked to French ideas in this respect; e.g. the Am. Rev. does not figure prominently in Dutch history books. – Cerberus Oct 27 '11 at 19:49

The last "class" concept I can think of the U.S. having would be segregation. I believe it was the "everyone is equal" movement (The whole "sitting at the front of the bus" thing) that lead to our current class-less "everyone is equal" state.

share|improve this answer
Not a bad answer. Welcome to the site. An upvote to get you going. – Tom Au Oct 27 '11 at 0:49
@Tom Thank you. :) – John Oct 27 '11 at 1:05
What about economic classes (labour vs capitalists)? – quant_dev Oct 27 '11 at 20:31
3  
@quant_dev - care to explain how a "labour" person making >70k a year with gold-plated medical insurance and platinum-plated (on paper) pension is somehow in a lower class than a guy who starts his own company and generally sees pretty much NO profit for the first couple of years? – DVK Nov 19 '11 at 22:31
3  
@quant_dev - What about a smart guy who worked hard for a couple of years, made some cash, and invested in the market and thereafter most of his income is investment returns (I personally know several, some who started from income of $10k/year)? There is no such thing as "labour" class vs "capitalist" in the European definition of a class. There are people with a spectrum of income distribution between wage income and investments - which varies through life for any given person, not separate classes. – DVK Nov 19 '11 at 22:34
show 4 more comments

Even if somebody can rise to height, does not make a society classless. Class is not an sealed set of people: people always can move from one class to another. You possibly confuse class with a social estate or caste the two being more closed divisions of society without easy ways to change.

What distinguishes class (by Marx) is the possession of the means of production. That means if a society has those who possesses means of production and those who do not, the society is not classless.

Income also is not a distinguishing criterion: a hired manager can have higher income than a farmer, but still he belongs to a different class.

share|improve this answer
That's an odd definition of class, I think. It puts a farmer and an semiconductor plant manager in one group (who possess means of production) and a bus driver and a stock trader in another (who don't possess means of production). – Joe May 10 '12 at 21:28
This is the Marxist definition. – Anixx Jul 23 '12 at 17:57
1  
It's not a very useful definition. It doesn't help you understand a person's income, ability to affect the economy, or social standing. – Joe Jul 23 '12 at 18:17
It is the only sense where the notion of class has meaning. – Anixx Jul 23 '12 at 23:17
1  
There are non-marxist uses of the term "class" that are meaningful and useful. The term can be used for economic strata, for nobility vs commoner, etc. – Mark C. Wallace Dec 10 '12 at 18:01
show 6 more comments

I agree with the New World statement, classes are something inherited from kingships, Like the nobility is the highest class. In America you can lose you class status in one generation (kids run the bussiness into the ground).

share|improve this answer
1  
Nobility is not a class, it is estate. – Anixx Sep 12 '12 at 13:16
The French called Nobility an estate - can you produce citations of the English using that term? (Honest question; I don't know the answer). – Mark C. Wallace Dec 10 '12 at 18:11

Gordon Wood's The Radicalism of the American Revolution contains a long discussion of this concept. (personal opinion, the discussion extends longer than useful, and seems focused on responding to an argument that isn't in the book).

I believe the question is founded on (one or more) false assumption; "The United States is a class-less society" is a conclusion, not a pre-existing idea. (others have discussed ad nauseum the imprecision involved in "class-less"). During the 1740's to 1780's, the institution of "class" was dysfunctional in the united states. (Here, I reject the marxist definition as lacking in utility; I refer to the more contemporary notion of gentry class vs commoner). The things that made that institution work in Britain (including the presence and active intervention of a King, a populist Tory party, and a strongly established Church of England) were absent in America.

One could argue that classlessness is an artifact of Republicanism of the period, but even Republicanism was fundamentally oligarchic. (one of the reasons for the failure of the Articles of Confederation was the "licentiousness" of the American populace. Writers of the period lamented the notion that craftsmen and tradesmen and merchants were involving themselves in politics, which was unacceptable). But Republicanism within the British constitution (such as it was at the time) was different from Republicanism in the Netherlands or in Switzerland - I think the argument very quickly drowns under the difficulty of defining Republicanism and Classlessness.

share|improve this answer

Your Answer

 
discard

By posting your answer, you agree to the privacy policy and terms of service.

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged or ask your own question.