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19

The original source for the stories you heard is apparently the book "Scorpion Down" by Ed Offley. The book's statements are questionable to say the least and this book review makes a good point. I checked what the Russian sources say about K-129. This 2008 interview with Viktor A. Dygalo, the commander of the division that K-129 belonged to, covers this ...


18

According to a 1999 article by Mark A. Bradley in Proceedings, the U.S. Naval Institute's professional journal ("Why They Called the Scorpion "Scrapiron," July 1998), on May 20, 1968, the Scorpion was ordered to intercept a Soviet flotilla near the Azores that included one Echo-II-class nuclear-propelled submarine, a submarine rescue vessel, two ...


11

If you look at ace sinking by year you'll find that aces could only develop their sink counts during "happy times," when a technical and doctrinal superiority favoured mass sinkings. These times often involved unimpeded surface running, surface attacks on individual ships, an absence of convoy systems and loosely protected convoys. While it may be ...


11

You are really talking not about seaworthiness, but about stability. "Together with the Hague Visby Rules, the common law provides that the concept of "seaworthiness" covers: the ship, its equipment and supplies, the crew, the vessel's suitability for the particular cargo and its suitability for the particular voyage or for particular ports". If the physics ...


9

Actually, no... the first submarines used in warfare appeared in the Revolutionary War, and two more were deployed (unsuccessfully) by the US in the War of 1812. 1) No, because they weren't very practical or successful until John Phillip Holland and Electric Boat perfected the battle submarine at the turn of the century. 2) The first modern military ...


7

During World War II, there were normally no U-boat operations during storms. WW2 vintage submarines required surface visibility to attack and had to be at periscope depth or above to attack. During a storm this was more or less impossible, so it created a temporary truce in which neither side could attack. Large naval ships tend to be very sea worthy. As ...


7

In short, politics. The Flensburg Government (Doenitz's German government) wanted to surrender to the Western allies (the United States and United Kingdom) rather than the Allies as a whole, primarily because of the Soviet reputation for how they (mis)treated prisoners. To this end, Admiral Friedeburg was sent to Field Marshal Montgomery's headquarters. ...


7

In addition to the answer above; Commander Michel Thomas Poirier, USN wrote a paper/study in October 1999 called Results of the German and American Submarine Campaigns of World War 2. In it he details many factors of both campaigns, it's well worth a read in it's entirety if you are interested in the subject. However, most relevantly to this topic is ...


7

The Venturer also sank U771 which was not submerged while being hit by torpedoes. This is wikipedia info, but apparently the British also used submarines for ASW. They seem to have lured in places where retreating/coming out of port, and would not be detected by passing submerged submarines. Alas, let us consider which other wars might have seen submarine ...


6

By 1944, US submarines were very experienced and had ironed out their problems with their equipment. They had been conducting an extremely successful offensive campaign against Japanese shipping since the beginning of 1942, and unlike German U-boats, had not taken heavy losses and so gained in experience. They had fixed the flaws in the Mark 14 torpedo ...


6

Each of these submarines were sunk in separate incidents, so I wanted to make sure that anyone seeing this understood that these two were not directly involved with one another in any form of conflict. The Soviet sub K-129 was sunk a few weeks prior to the loss of the USS Scorpion, and some theories suggest that the Scorpion was sunk in retaliation for the ...


4

Not mentioned so far is the Allies progressively better use of radar. Diesel submarines spent a lot of time on the surface, at least until the Germans developed snorkels. If they could be seen on radar, they were easy pickings. They could also be located by radio triangulation, so toward they end of the war they had to maintain radio silence. In such ...


3

Before WWI torpedoes and torpedo boats had a much greater impact on naval tactics than submarines which were still generally considered a bit of a novelty. The Revolutionary War and Civil War examples were essentially weapons of desperation against a vastly superior blockading force and not particularly successful. Torpedo Boats were a different story as a ...


3

According to my calculation from this official list, http://www.history.navy.mil/research/library/online-reading-room/title-list-alphabetically/u/us-navy-ships-lost-in-selected-storm-weather-related-incidents.html US navy lost 5 or 6 destroyers due to bad weather conditions, with total loss of about 1,300 people.


3

Due to the low surfaced speed and even more limited speed/endurance submerged, in order for pre-modern submarines to take part in a fleet action they need to be pre-positioned on patrol lines, choke points etc likely to intercept the opposing fleet. This was Japanese doctrine for a major fleet action. In the case of the Philippine Sea the US being on the ...


2

First of all the Japanese had significantly fewer submarines, by a factor of 3, than the US and the subs that they did have were for the most part smaller subs with less range and capability. The US fleet had the advantage that it mostly operated in blue water where it is much more difficult for a sub to find a target. In general, attacking warships was ...


2

It is unlikely that a Soviet sub sank the Scorpion. At the time, Soviet subs were considerably more noisy and slower than American subs. To follow or shadow the Scorpion a Soviet Echo would have had to go at speeds that would have made it easily detectable by the sonar room of the Scorpion. To attack in such a situation would be extremely risky. When a ...


2

On 9 January 1942, the Japanese submarine I-73 (or I-173) was sunk by the US submarine USS Gudgeon (SS-211). The action meant that the USS Gudgeon was the first US Navy warship to sink an enemy warship in WWII. References: http://www.hazegray.org/danfs/submar/ss211.txt http://www.history.navy.mil/library/online/japaneseshiploss.htm


2

I agree that the above was the only battle between two submerged submarines. More to the point, I'd be surprised if there was ever a battle between two SURFACED submarines. BY DEFINITION, submarines do not like to fight on the surface. They are small ships with no guns (to speak of), and are therefore not a match for a warship when surfaced. Their primary ...


2

There is a famous book/movie, "Run Silent, Run Deep", which involves a submarine duel based loosely on real events. Submarines can and will hunt and kill each other. In WWII torpedoes did not have active seekers, but relied on contact fusing, which means you would have to set the depth of the torpedo and make a direct hit. This would be very difficult to do ...


1

The type XXI U-boat manufactured during 1944, but not ready until too late was qualitatively far superior to any submarines anywhere. Even older type VII and Type IX U-boats adopted advanced technologies with Schnorkel, Acoustic torpedoes, NAXOS, TUNIS and SAMOS radar warning receivers. By mid 1944 two dozen U-boats had FMU-200 Hohenweil radar sets. It ...



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